Ep. 2: Bringing Humanity Together Through Connection with Ali El Alfy

In this episode, Rania Badreldin and her guest Ali El Alfy discuss the topic of Bringing Humanity Together Through Connection, from how to ground and connect with ourselves to turning that outwards and connecting with humanity as a whole.

Transcript

Ali: And I think this is exactly what we're going through collectively right now thanks to the the great bravery of the Palestinian people. They're probably sick of hearing words like resilient and inspirational but um I think they stand an example to all of us, they're showing the way.

[Music] Welcome to Happiness for Humanity I'm Rania Badreldin, the happiness consultant from Egypt. Join me and my guests for an hour of meaningful conversations for a happier world. [Music]

Rania:
In today's episode I'm joined by Ali El Alfy and I'm gonna let Ali explain who he is and what he does. Ali, thank you so much for joining me today.

Ali:
It's a pleasure Rania, thank you for having me. If I were to introduce myself, I'd say I help people connect to themselves and by that I mean cultivate awareness and self-compassion. And I do that using, or with the aid of, three tools, three guides, the body, the breath, and nature.

Rania:
And I'm really happy you're with me today because uh I think we really need a lot of connection. We need a lot of connection with ourselves first and then we need to really figure out how to connect with one another. Um I'm not sure, uh, actually I do know how you feel about the state of the world at the moment because I've been following you, uh, and I think you know you'll probably agree with me that one of the first solutions to all that is for us to first individually connect with ourselves and then, you know, from there spread that outwards. How do you feel about that?

Ali:
Yeah I think that's spot on uh I think connection is the key, the remedy, and it starts with self. And um you know we might have great ideas but if we're going to follow through with them, if, we might see a vision of how to proceed but um if we're actually going to make progress, I was going to say I think, but my conviction is, that connection being grounded in oneself, rooted in not just this body consciousness but who we are, what we stand for, aligned with our values. I think that's the way forward, the sustainable way forward. A way forward that, you know, isn't about um increasing the bottom line or uh or earnings or GDP but um but about bringing humanity together. And back to I'm passionate about the earth, it's ridiculous to say because we belong to the earth, we are extensions of the earth, no less than than the trees and animals um, but to come home to ourselves is um is to realize our interconnectedness and um to abide by that I think is the way forward. So you you hit the nail on the head I think we could just end the conversation here in fact.

Rania:
No, no, no I'm not going to let you go that easily. You have a lot to say and a lot of wisdom and I'm gonna keep you here. No but yeah, absolutely, and but the thing is maybe for you, maybe for me now only in recent years, I can understand what that means when you say connect with yourself. I have an idea of how to do that. I have done that finally, it took a few decades but I understand. But it might not be so obvious or easy for some people to answer that question. "Okay so you're saying I need to connect with myself, okay, how do I do that?" And I think that's a valid question.

Ali:
Yeah, I think it's a great question and it's uh it's one of those life questions. Everyone's looking for a quick answer, you know, everyone's looking for a key and um I just turn it and you know, I'm there, the lights have turned on, I'm enlightened. And um I personally struggled with this a long time. I have this um, well I'm quite intellectually oriented, uh my mind is uh quite a domineering thing, and um and I think we can all start with just feeling, coming home to the body, because that's like an anchor.

There's a great saying, I butchered it the last time I tried to recall it but it's a Sufi saying. It says "the body is on the shore of being." So we all want this, well not all of us but uh those of us who start this path or look to this path of call it spirituality, call it awakening, call it what you like uh, call it coming home to yourself. We want to ascend, we want to turn that key and get there, but um but we forget that it starts with this body we have, this breath here and now. Um I'll stick with the Sufi line a minute longer um and uh Sayidna Abubakr El Sideek says "ana bayna nafasayn", what I am is between two breaths. You can translate that so many ways but uh my point is the body and the breath, we have these right? We don't need to go into books to read about them. God knows I have many you could borrow but um you have a direct route back to yourself and um and that is the key as far as I'm concerned. Body, breath, nature.

Rania:
Yes, wow

Ali:
And feel, allow yourself to feel without intellectualizing.  That's the issue, we start to scratch the surface and then the mind hijacks the process and says ah "I'm on to something", you know, "this is it" and it becomes this intellectualized process that misses the point.

Rania:
I think a lot of people, I was one of them anyway, are afraid to feel and don't want to feel because it's painful and I think right now at the time of recording this episode a lot of people are feeling, uh there's so many things that they're seeing through their screens that make them feel horrified, make them feel sad, make them feel angry, depending on people how they perceive things. So I think there's a lot of feeling happening but the question is as well, what do we do with those feelings? And how do we, you know, use those feelings in a good way, in a positive way, because you know there's a lot of feelings around. I  actually learned from you, I want to tell you this actually, um it was really  powerful. I took a meditation course with you. So I went on a yoga retreat with you but I also, I don't know if you remember, that I also took a meditation course with you. It was in Ramadan.

Ali:
I remember Aswan but not the course.

Rania:
Yeah no no I took the course a few years after the yoga retreat it was uh in Ramadan. And it was just uh maybe I don't know two-three maybe sessions to teach us how to meditate. And I used to be the furthest person away from all of this stuff and like "I'm not going to just sit there and close my eyes" and I was this you know kind of person who's always hustling and, you know that kind of thing, and um uh I've definitely slowed down considerably since then.

But one thing I want to say that really helped me a lot with my emotions was a Thich Nhat Hahn meditation that you did with us. And basically it was about bringing together our thoughts and emotions, sort of the less than positive ones, the ones that we're struggling with or having trouble overcoming, and bringing them towards us and holding them with love, and I, in the middle of the meditation, I couldn't believe this, I was like "okay bring together all these you know really horrible thoughts and emotions and now he's probably going to tell us to like throw them out the window or to you know.." and then you said the opposite. You said to hold them..

Ali:
Cradle them, tell them they're allowed.

Rania:
Yeah and then this is when I realized, and I've been doing that by the way ever since. What I realized is allow them, accept them, actually show them love, show them compassion and let them stay for as long as they want I remember that was part of it until they're ready to go.

Ali:
Until they're ready to leave.

Rania:
They yeah. And if they're not ready to go, I remember it was put them in a cradle or you know something next to you and let them stay there and you can revisit them sometime later. Wow, okay that's fantastic. That was a way for me to finally figure out what to do when I have overpowering, overwhelming thoughts and emotions that I just don't know what to do with. So I can first of all accept them, love them, uh breathe, sit with them, allow them to leave if they're ready. If they're not, I can place them to the side and I can revisit them maybe in the afternoon, maybe at 5 or 6 o'clock, or maybe tomorrow morning. I don't have to be with them all day and that was very liberating for me because for the longest time as it turned out, I didn't know that, I was definitely suppressing emotions. I didn't want to feel them, it was hard for me. And now it's still hard to feel sometimes, but it makes me feel alive. It makes me feel human, and it makes me feel that I can now do something with those emotions. So thank you for that. I wanted to say that.

Ali:
It lights my heart to hear you uh say that was impactful for you, that you're putting it to good use still. You know everything I teach is um is all that has been impactful for me, all that has helped me. I can certainly appreciate what it means to struggle with feelings, to suppress feelings, to not understand feelings in the first place. I spent a better part of my life, I believe I must have been in my mid 20s or early 20s before I started  reckoning with the overwhelm of emotions that I was feeling. What is this and what do I do with with it?

So I think it's a universal struggle, whether we're sensitive or more avoidant, I think we we all run from difficult feelings or turn away um or pretend they're not even there.  But the good news is they come up and um and then we have a choice, are we going to face them or not, and the better news is if you choose to face them, if you choose to embark on this thing of waking up, cleaning up, growing up, support comes. Whether it's uh via a little reel on Instagram or a holy man with a beard or holy man with a pointy cap or um or a friend who's been telling you exactly what might serve you and suddenly now you're opening up to it um or receptive to it because you're open. It's there. Uh you know Jalal El Rumi says "what you seek is seeking you" and I think uh what's important is to figure out what our intention is because we all have this um capacity to heal, to grow, to grow more conscious, to evolve, but how specifically do you see yourself doing that or what is it you want for yourself?

When you define your intention, support comes, support appears. It's already there, it just becomes available. With the um the feelings there just so many different ways but like I said the good news is they come up, so are you just receptive, are you allowing yourself to feel into, to face the resistance? And I found that the fear is often worse than the thing we fear. So our perception of what it's going to be like if I allow this feeling is so much gloomier than the actual experience of feeling the feeling. Now there might be some exceptions but I think it serves us no matter what it is depression, anxiety, heartbreak, not only does it serve us but this is the real life alchemy.

This is how we transmute our pain to power, our anger and our fear to love. This is how we grow our capacity and I think this is exactly what we're going through collectively right now thanks to the great bravery of the Palestinian people. They're probably sick of hearing words like resilient and inspirational but um I think they stand an example to all of us, they're showing the way. Of course sacrificing with uh with their lives but uh there is this parallel for each of us I hope we're waking up to the 75 year.. everyone says it started in 1948 but uh Israel's tyranny starts even before it was a state. People forget that or don't know that uh armed Jewish militias, and I don't say that anti-semitically, they were Jewish militias. These were the original terrorists of the land. These are the people who drove the British out, so the Palestinian struggle began not on October 7th, the conflict didn't begin on October 7th, and it didn't begin in 1948, it began long before that and I hope people are waking up to that.

But it's not just about the Palestinian people. Crazy thing to say right now but the opportunity for humanity is in the individuals opening up to what they've been repressing, to the darkness inside. And I say that without judgment. Darkness is all that we repress, all that we're unconscious of. All that we've chosen or been unable to face until now. So when we look to our grief, our pain, our suffering, our own biases, our own um, what. Perhaps there are people out there that are realizing right now that "I am classist", "I am unjust", "There is a brand of racism that I harbor" and I hope we open up to that and allow ourselves to take inventory of it and very compassionately begin to see what we carry. I think that's the great opportunity in all of this: to free Palestine, to check systemic racism, this white supremacy that happens to be Jewish and also to liberate ourselves of the shackles we self-impose.

Rania:
And also to differentiate though, as well, between people and their governments is an important thing to do, because otherwise we are going to see a lot of hate being spread, which I already do see. So if we are trying to go back to love, which that's what we're about. We're/I think we're born as love and uh if we have more love inside us then we have more love to project outside us. So I do agree that it's about figuring out what are the things I need to unlearn that maybe were, you know, wired into my mind about a certain other group of people uh and then to start to see all people as people, as one, and then to recognize that some people's behaviors are not aligned with universal values that all religions share or that even people who you know don't believe in religion can believe in.

So there are universal humanitarian, I think, values that we can agree on that I don't think anybody really wants to see, yet somehow we allow ourselves either to be distracted in our own lives and to just like trust that other people are going to be making big decisions for us. And then we see things that are completely unacceptable to ourselves as loving human beings, which is I think our true essence, and then we're just watching people be unloving. So I try, so of course it's a struggle to figure out "okay what are some biases I still have" and I've been working through all of these things. Also I'm still trying to make sure that I don't label the person, but label the behavior. So even when I come to the person who I think is behind/ the biggest person who is behind what's happening, I try to think "okay well it's not him, you know, but what he's doing I'm totally 100% against", you know, so I'm still trying to always do that because that's what I think is right. Because in the end everybody is a person, right? And some people for whatever reasons, usually they have trauma they haven't worked through, they've reached a certain point in their mind that actually makes them feel that they're right. Or they don't think they're right but whatever, they're going through for certain agendas, but even that person..

Ali:
People justify crazy things.

Rania:
Right

Ali:
People justify crazy things out of fear, out of pain, out of uh loss, uh we reframe our existence in those terms and I think that's exactly what's happened with the creation of the state of Israel. And you're a spot on, we ought to differentiate between the leadership and the policies and the uh individuals because there are so many Israelis that fight for human rights. There are so many people who refuse to take up the mandatory military service and these are among the bravest people in the whole region, Palestinians aside.

Rania:
Yes and their voices have been loud as well I mean -

Ali:
and impactful -

Rania:
yes like I never knew that. Like I have to admit and I felt, I still feel, like I can't believe where was I? Was I like under a rock or something? This has been going on for decades and only now I'm like feeling it so much? But you know what? It's these people actually who helped me, among the voices who helped me feel it most are voices like you know Jewish Voice for Peace or you know Breaking the Silence and so there are so many, well there are so many voices all around us actually that are speaking up and that are beautiful and uh I try to remember that because I I know that people are feeling where's our humanity and I understand that line of thinking -

Ali:
it's inside, it's within all of us, even the wicked, it's just been suppressed. And I think it brings us back to, what you're saying is so key, it brings us back to the beginning of the conversation. We always have a choice to see in terms of connection, are we looking to ground down and relate to the other human? Even if it is a warmonger sitting across the table, can I understand their point of view? Not to justify their behavior but to understand where they're coming from and this, it's exactly what you said it's love, but love in the form of compassion which is the seeking to understand without judgment. The want to know where behavior emanates from, what suffering birthed this, and um that is the great takeaway. That is the opportunity to grow understanding towards ourselves, to understand our personal suffering but also to be able to relate to others.

My best friend's Palestinian, I ,his family is my family. I grew up, I'm probably more outspoken than he is, and um I grew up with this. And I hated the enemy at one point. But what did that do for me? It burned me up. And only recently after all this work, 10 years I've been on this path of trying to heal my body, my mind, my heart, and um only recently when I got into trauma work did I begin to understand, and I don't claim to understand deeply or fully, I think that's an ongoing process, but appreciate what the Holocaust must have done to a Jewish collective, what um generations of suffering. And I think the Arab and Muslim world is rightfully aggravated, enraged to be blamed for Jewish oppression when our countries were a safe haven for the Jews, when the Jewish people were part and parcel of our population, Egyptians and Iraqis and Moroccans and Algerians, just like anyone else until Israel created this divisiveness and our proud nationalistic uh leaders pushed them, pushed them to the door and they joined the Israeli State.

I met a young woman um of Egyptian descent, an Israeli woman in university. She was uh in my dorms and she identified as Egyptian, but she also looked at me with skepticism and fear, and um to try to understand where that comes from is to come a step closer to understanding not just the other but ourselves and gain this capacity to relate, to connect. So it's certainly not the Jewish people that are the problem. It's that bit of darkness that circles around that makes victims of all of us and you know sometimes it has a little mustache and other times it uh it leverages that to justify what it's doing to the Palestinian people, but the Israelis even if they're living in Israel are not the problem. It's the unhealed trauma, it's this militarism, it's this rightwing government that thrives on fear just like capitalism thrives on chopping down the rainforests and um you're absolutely right, and I'm so glad you brought it up, it's so important to see our neighbors as human beings even if they happen to occupy land of our kin, um land that was previously, it's so tricky right, because you have millions of people now living in Israel and what are we going to do, we're going to displace them? I don't think that's the solution, and that's not what people are calling for when they say From The River To The Sea. They're calling for a Palestinian state. They're calling for the, not equal rights, the independent right for self-determination. A state where they can ensure their own human rights and dignity, where they don't have to live in survival and worry about Israel dropping bombs or turning the fuel off or turning the power off or depriving them of water or blowing up all the hospitals or taking out ambulances once they've delivered a handful of people across the Rafah border.

So it's um it's a matter of people, human rights, liberty before peace. Liberty brings peace.

Rania:
Exactly yeah that's one of my, uh the things I noticed at the very beginning of this, is I was always thinking of and calling for peace, and then I realized wait wait wait peace can actually mean that one group of people is just staying peaceful within being occupied, so that's not the goal then. Then it's not just about peace. What we need first is freedom and liberation before that and so yeah I've been going through, like every single day my mind is thinking and questioning and thinking of myself and then thinking of, you know, "okay what are the solutions to all of this?" I mean is this really where we want to be as humanity? If we really think of humanity as one, is this really where we want to be? And I'm assuming the answer is no, and so if the answer is no, okay, how did we get here is important, everybody's talking about how did we get here, but what's important to me now is how do we move towards a different vision of the world we want to live in? And how do we start to see ourselves able to live lovingly with everybody around us who is maybe entirely different in some ways and also so similar in many ways? And that's what I'm interested in now because I can't uh really pretend that I'm going to make a huge difference in what's happening right this minute but I will certainly use my voice, use whatever resources I have to do my best, you know, to maybe make some sort of a difference right now, okay.

Ali:
On that point, can we just can we just address that point? Because -

Rania:
yes let's -

Alia:
because we tend to uh small ourselves down -

Rania:
yeah we don't need to -

Ali:
or look at things in magnanimous proportions and then that too is self-defeating, disempowering. But just consider, and I know you know this well, but if each of us were to consider that I'm a part of the whole and if what I can do is shine bright, I'm not talking about fame here or gaining Instagram followers, but be my best self, my most loving self and maybe that means be with the aches and the pains. If I can just center, honor what I'm feeling, feel my body, align with this breath, maybe that brings a whole lot to the table. Can you imagine what the world would look like if everyone was centered, grounded, no matter what they were doing at the negotiating table or cooking dinner for their kids? That right there is a shift.

Rania:
Yeah, you're right. I mean I think we're seeing now is a world where egos are just bumping at each other. People aren't sort of connected with their higher self or their spirit or whatever you want to call it depending on what you believe. That's not, these are not the people who are leading the world. And I think that's part of my big thing now, it's so funny because like I really never ever really wanted to talk about or think about politics or any of that stuff, but now I'm like "wait a minute, this is ridiculous." How can we allow ourselves to be governed by people who are not centered and self-reflective and have not done the trauma work and have not.. so they're projecting -

Ali:
and acting from all of that, consuming the world and the people in it like like they're um -

Rania:
so that's it? This is it? I mean so we're gonna.., and there are only a few people. I mean if you think about it, I mean we're like led and governed as an entire, you know everybody on the planet is led and governed by just a few people right? So they're not like millions. I don't know how many they are and -

Ali:
and they're using 4% of the population to actually make sure we're doing -

Rania:
so how is that okay? and so we need to just remember like we live here, and we can love here, with our fellow human beings. And we can love them all. and it's all about what we're seeing and hearing, and of course we're seeing and hearing different things so based on what we're seeing and hearing people are perceiving things in different ways obviously. So to cut through, and it takes a lot of work, to cut through all of the noise around us, to cut through all of the different things the media is telling us, and then to get still enough to find out what is true and what is true to you -

Ali:
that's it, what's true to me -

Rania:
and of course that takes a lot of work.. yeah but then that takes a lot of work and so probably the average person is you know busy with their nine to five and then their whatever, their kids in the afternoons, so they're not going to necessarily sit and do all that and for many people this is a "conflict" in one part of the world um, so there are actually things happening in so many parts of the world. I actually/I don't even know about them so like I now know that there's things happening in so many parts of the world, there are other genocides happening. I don't have the bandwidth, or maybe I do, that's maybe a limiting belief, but I am not currently spending my bandwidth also researching on a daily basis and educating myself about those atrocities. But then somebody also needs to address those right?

So there's like so much to do, so much work, I think, to do. Inner work and then outer work. And I think the outer work has to, in the end, be about connecting on a human level with anybody and everybody who's in power, or you know overpowered, or whatever, but just people. And peacefully connecting. I mean like okay so I obviously, not obviously, but I am not somebody who ever uh was for wars and weapons and all of that stuff. Like this is not my world uh, yet this is a reality at the moment, so I just wonder whether is it completely, ridiculously naive to think that we can shift, move forward, and away, and towards a reality that doesn't have weapons and war as part of its existence? I wonder. What do you think?

Ali:
I don't think that's ridiculous. I can hear right now um a number of my old political science teachers and uh some radical human beings, extremist human beings, saying that's nuts. But um I think we can create whatever future we like. And that's not to say that suffering will ever cease, but there's a difference between the means of suffering and the suffering itself. And you said something, you know something so spot on. There are a number of genocides, other genocides, happening around the world. There's suffering in Congo, in Sudan, the Uyghers, we stopped speaking about them but they're not walking around free. And not just in Muslim countries, populations, but across the world there are oppressed. We forget that the Hawaiians, because we think of Frangipanis and uh lays and dancing, but the Hawaiians are an oppressed people um and countless other examples. And you're right. One would drown if they tried to just sit with all of that or look into all of that.

But you bring a an important point up and it relates to the point I made earlier that it starts with us and it's not to say, you know, "I stopped reading the news" and "I uh barricade myself" because that is another layer of denial, resistance, uh uh bypassing, but to be more concerned with what you can influence, what one can influence, this coming home to oneself, this washing of my wounds, this taking inventory of everything I feel, this coming to know "what is it I stand for and align with?" And it may not be a constant. We're like rivers, we change all the time. And if you don't there's a question to ask about that. But I think that's the point of power, and that's how we might change the world. If we were to get to know ourselves better, to wake up, be a little more conscious, we would then ask questions. We would, just as we hold ourselves accountable, we would begin to hold others accountable, and that, the tip of that pyramid you talked about, those, the handful of people that control the world and the narrative and the resources and the wealth, where would they be without all of us who prop them up?

So we could you know stand up in arms and go look for those handfuls, I don't think we'd get past security, or we could wake up. And um and there's no way to contain that. I always say that the one thing that lives on from the revolution, from the Egyptian revolution, was that spark that they cannot imprison, that they cannot take away, that they cannot kill. And there's something far more powerful about a revolution of self had by the masses. I mean, I pray, maybe it's a crazy dream, but I'm beginning to see it. I'm beginning to see people wake up, start to look at matters with eyes that they didn't have yesterday. And I think that is the key, the opportunity, that's within each of.. each of us has an opportunity to do just that. It's within our capacity and power.

And the point I wanted to come to, you said "so much suffering I don't have the bandwidth." It's such an important point in trauma work. This is talked about as, or referred to as, our um capacity to contain feelings, contain pain, contain suffering. And trauma is exactly the opposite of that, it's too much too quickly. So what we can do, whether we're healing from trauma or trying to take in a devastating genocide, I keep coming back to Gaza but you're absolutely right it's suffering everywhere, what I can do is learn to little by little increase my capacity to be with what's difficult. And that's practice, that takes practice. That's a process and you know if you're thinking "but that's too much time", you're missing the point, it's about here and now. It's about reorienting so that every day you're making time to be with your feelings, whether you're bringing your hand to your heart and feeling into that, journaling, doing that Thich Nhat Hanh technique and maybe we can make it available um with this post in a link. I think it's a bit, I don't teach that uh off the bat anymore it's a bit um, -

Rania:
actually I have, I've actually recorded it -

Ali:
you have? -

Rania:
yeah because I was so inspired by it and it worked for me so I actually/ I have a recording of me reading it out -

Ali:
I just recommend with people start with something small, manageable, baby step. Build up your capacity to contain big feelings and then one day, one day you'll be able to hold all your hurt, and one day you'll be able to hold a space for others who can hurt. But start with yourself. We're, too many of us are trying to save the world when maybe the key is to look to ourselves and try to come home, come home with compassion. I'm reluctant to say save ourselves, but why not?

Rania:
Yeah, yeah.

Ali:
So bandwidth. Increase your capacity to contain feelings and start with, even before any of that, grounding and orienting. A rooted tree stands up to a storm.

Rania:
So by grounding you actually mean literally grounding? Putting your feet on the ground?

Ali:
Yeah literally grounding. Yeah um not just your feet on the ground, your feet on the ground... so if you're listening to this and you're in a seat, allow yourself to just feel your feet on the ground, even if they're in shoes, even if you're on the 11 story of a building, feel your booty in your seat. Allow yourself to rest back and receive the support of the chair and feel into all the support you're getting from beneath, and breathe now and with each exhale just allow your attention to descend, your body to relax down, allow roots to extend from the base of your seat down your legs and into the earth. Ground. It's simple, it's just about feeling the support we get from Mother Earth by way of the floor in our highrise and the chair supporting our body up if that's what it is, but if you can, get out there bare feet against the earth, wooh does something that. Earthing is real. So to ground is for me the basis of finding security in my connection with myself and that's so important. Safety.

So ground and then orient, and orienting is so simple, it's allowing your eyes to very slowly, super slowly scan the space you're in no matter how familiar, even if it's your bedroom it does something for the nervous system and that's the key there, the nervous system. I've searched around the house uh so full of tools to do with self- inquiry and healing, and nervous system turned out to be the missing key at least for me. So ground, orient, yeah just scan and be sure to twist and look over one shoulder and the other that stimulates your uh nervous system on a physical level and then think of something that inspires safety or maybe you see it in your room, your grandpa's photo or that uh stone you picked up the day you climbed the volcano and felt really empowered. Find some resource that inspires safety and the key is to sit with the feeling. Drop the story. Thank you Grandpa, you've inspired the feeling. Now sit with the feeling, allow that to expand, breathe into it, or see it grow and feel into that experience. This felt sense is so very powerful and um I know for me when I get taken away by the أحداث "events",  or caught up in loops of anxiety, I'm not feeling my body. So don't just ground, but orient and feel into safety. Consider what inspires that sense of security and it can be a person, place, or a thing. It can be present with you or conjured up by memory or imagination. It can be, for me one of my power animals is a wolf, now I've started to picture a whole pack of wolves and in fact a tiger sitting beside me and a bear right behind me and I can feel that right now, that becomes my experience.

Rania:
Wow.

Ali:
And that is healing, that is empowering.

Rania:
Yes.

Ali:
And that helps us then make choices that are based on what/ that are rooted in being rather than, you know, ideas of what might serve me, what I might need, or God forbid, you know, what's um what's going to hurt my enemy.

Rania:
Yeah yeah, I mean getting into the cycles of revenge or violence, that's far removed from the things you're talking about and uh -

Ali:
it's the opposite, being far from yourself. I listen to Gabor Mate and he was talking about Netanyahu the one you wanted not to name um, but let's call him out like Voldemort. He said put him on mute and just look at his body language and what you see there, Gabor Mate who is a deeply compassionate man, one time Zionist who went to uh Palestine and realized my God this is all wrong, this is everything my people suffered. He says if you put Netanyahu on mute, you see the body language of a human being disconnected from his humanity. And I'm not just saying that to call him out, I'm saying that because the opposite is true too. If you come home to your body, yeah, you feel into safety, you align with your breath and yourself, you ground down, you connect with your humanity. I think that's what we all need on an individual level and a collective level.

Rania:
Absolutely, yes, 100%. And actually, now that you mention Gabor Mate,  when people uh criticize him for being a traitor to his people, I was thinking about that last week, and I realized, to me, I don't relate to this at all. Because to me the point is that all people are my people. So I cannot be a traitor to my people if everybody is my people. And that's more of what I want us to work towards. I mean it's not about a certain group of people. It's about all of us. So of course he's not a traitor. He's true to his values of humanity. But the thing is that's mind-boggling to me is that I see other people who believe I guess a certain narrative, use humanity as their justification as well. So you have people saying yeah but if you have any humanity then you have to, for example, not want to cease fire. I just don't get it. So the word humanity, and of course this podcast is called Happiness for Humanity now, for a reason obviously, because it's just been on my mind for the last month and a half. And it's so weird to me to hear humanity used by different opposing people as the justification for their actions. That's just, it doesn't make any sense and it doesn't make any sense to want to continue killing people in the name of humanity. So there's just so much that's not clear, ununderstood.

And again we can drive ourselves crazy trying to figure it all out, it's not going to work, so what we can do is focus on ourselves, focus on what we can do and how we can use our voice I think, and how we can be a positive influence, uh and also to be careful I think in terms of what we um what are we spreading. So are we spreading something that works towards the world we want to see? Or are we spreading hate? Or are we spreading you know uh violence or whatever? So I'm just, I guess I'm saying this for myself, for you, to see what you think about all this. I guess for somebody like me because .. I've always, I just want to see people happy and getting along. I'm that you know, some people say naive, but to me I just want to see people happy and I want people to get along and so that's obviously not what I'm seeing. I see it in my small circles obviously because I make sure that I have circles like that but on a global scale it's just not what's happening uh and I really think we're just smarter than that I mean -

Ali:
some of us -

Rania: it's 2023 we're supposed to be much smarter, what did you say?

Ali:
Some of us -

Rania:
and I mean we're supposed to be, right? We're supposed to be so advanced and so technologically you know like superior to where we were. Supposedly, right? So if we're so smart, why is the state of the world the way it is? And... that's why I'm doing this podcast because I just want to have these conversations. I certainly don't claim to have all the answers. I think you and I have presented some answers here and I hope that they've been helpful. I really think that they have actually um, and I want to have more conversations and sort of unravel this mystery of how in the world are we in this world right now today? And really decide what kind of world we want to be in and then actually do something about it and not just sit in a room and be with ourselves only, as you said. We need to do that but if we only do that then we're not actually also participating in terms of an active role in creating that world. So it's kind of like be and do kind of thing, you know. So sometimes we're just going to be still and be and that's where we can tap into the beauty that is inside each one of us and then other times we really need to do something with that. And whatever we do with that is bound to be beautiful right? That's the idea, so that's these are my thoughts.

Ali:
You know I think the people who claim it's naive um your wish how did you put it? Happy and together? something of the sort

Rania:
happy and getting along

Ali:
happy and getting along. Maybe it's too simplistic for them but I think that is indication of where the world's at. I really believe we've developed away from our humanity, whether we're talking about technological advancements that really don't serve our core needs and the health of our earth or these um radical lines of thought that become dogma and divisive ultimately. It can be, it should be, a lot simpler than that. Am I connected to myself? Am I feeling into my body right now? And right away for some people something will say "you don't have time for that" or "that's ridiculous". Look to that resistance. What is that voice? Has it been leading you? Is it reasonable not to honor your body, not to honor your feelings, not to slow down and observe this breath, feel your feet on the ground? Because if you're not connected to yourself how are you going to meaningfully connect to anyone else?

But you know I think we ought to, I spent too many years trying to convince the Israeli girl across the floor from me uh at the dorms um, other Jewish friends that I met along the way, of Palestine's humanity, the fact that they're actual human beings that are suffering and oppressed, and I think now is the time to focus, to shift the narrative, to speak about the cause in our own terms, to talk about the Nakba, to talk about 75 years of land grabbing, to talk about the fact that before the state of Israel, Christians Muslims, and Jews cohabitated and for the most part, a few uh Jewish terrorist groups aside, got along quite well and not just in Palestine but throughout the Arab world. And um I think we ought to talk about Palestinian rights, the fact that their children deserve a future too.

You know, I live just above the ground floor and I get so aggravated because my nervous system is still carrying so much stuff of old, I get so aggravated by the sounds of the street the constant whooh, whooh, whooh, the Cairo sounds and the "sayes" and the driver and then I think, because this triggers, me it triggers my nervous system, it brings up like I said the old stuff and then I stopped to think about what it must be like to live in Gaza. Maybe we could all just put ourselves in their shoes for a moment and maybe that would stir something in us.

But yeah back to the narrative, speaking about our people's suffering, the fact that, you know I was not just to uh that Israeli girl, but there was this look of skepticism that I got from the majority of you know, I hate to frame it this way, but uh white people in my dorms in Montreal, in the university in general. My name might be Ali, I might be from Egypt, but it doesn't mean I'm out to get you. I, you know, I don't go about my life planning, you know, or trying to get into Hamas or Hisballah, or planning how I'm going to devastate your people and your family. If anything, I just want to belong like you. And I think um I think we ought to speak about our experiences with Islamophobia over the last 20, at least 20 years. We ought to speak about the Palestinian cause. We ought to speak about our humanity, in our terms. We really need to shift the narrative. Stop talking through them and start talking about our experience.

But maybe that starts with taking inventory, really asking questions you know? What um, what do I stand for? Who am I? Who do I, what do I subscribe to? Because, you know, this us versus them that makes Gabor Mate a traitor is very relevant to us too. It's in the, you know, the Arab nationalism that Abdel Nasser planted it's in this, you know, proudly flying of the Egyptian flag thinking we are better than Libyans or Saudis or Syrians. I wish the Arab world would well for starters begin to see the commonalities, the common denominators, let's start there. And then let's expand that circle a little bit so it includes other people, people beyond. I think that's it you know, what's the common denominator, and you know you can uh, starting opens you up to connection. It makes this thing of relating uh begin, and in the title of your, is this the podcast?

Rania:
Yes Happiness for Humanity, it's a podcast.

Ali:
Humanity, that's the common denominator.

Rania:
Yeah yeah yeah it is, and to me, you see I just see all that very clearly, so to me it's/I still can't believe people aren't able to see each other as one, because I do. And I don't look at where people are from, or what their religion is, or nothing. I don't look at any of that. I just look at the person inside, who I know is just a person who was born wired for kindness, actually science shows us that. They're just a person who has gone through life and experienced different things. They're a person who has gone through life and heard and you know, well, saw different things and so it's affected them. And then this is the outcome today and this is how/what their behavior is like today. They're just a person just like me. So to me, it's mind-boggling this whole thing that we still are differentiating between people because of all of the things we're talking about. Because they're just people. We're just, we're all babies at one point. We're all just born. I mean how is that not obvious to anybody? But I guess it's because of I mean, I'm not even, all the nationalistic things or all the, you know, "with us, against us" blah blah blah, like I don't relate to any of that.

Ali:
It's manipulation. The bottom line is, it serves one group, one group that holds power to coral um a number of people and say "you're with us now go, go fight for us."

Rania:
Yeah exactly. So I mean just the idea even that, okay I understand what I'm going to say is now really naive because that probably wouldn't work, but just the idea that we share/ we're here on this planet and then we've decided to cut it up into pieces like a big pizza now we've created different pieces of the pizza.

Ali:
Wait wait wait, can we just recognize that the French and the British started all of that? It might have happened anyway because we have this capacity right? Our mind,  specifically our left brain does this thing of separating between one and the other. It's how we perceive spaces, how we assess threat, so it's a natural human function, so I hope when you look to it and see it in you, you see it compassionately. But I just wanted to point out, French and British, thank you very much.

Rania:
Right, but even then, when we say the French and the British we mean particular people who were French and particular people who were British at the time. So again, it does not mean that French people and British people today have anything to do with that or even agree to it right? So I -

Ali:
God bless the the French and the British turning up to the streets at least the British because it's illegal in France supporting Palestine but uh -

Rania:
and then look at the protests and the marches, and I mean come on, we like I said I mean that I'm just saying this to myself as well, and we need to be careful how we're thinking about people versus their governments. But yeah okay, so it started at some point that we decide to divide land, and then to say that this is now/these are our borders and then now you can come to my country, but you can't, and if you're from this country oh you need a visa, and if you're from that country you don't, and all of that stuff is just to differentiate people and to further divide people.

I think we're here to come together, not to be divided. I think we're here to get to know one another, not to be afraid of one another uh and that's what I would like to see more of. I mean if every single person on this planet got to know, got to become friends with, somebody who they are even afraid of today, who they think, you know they've been told there's something wrong with that person, and they can become friends with them. If we each do that, we have one friend who is just so very different from us, or so we think, then maybe we can connect and come to realize that we are one, we are human beings. So that's kind of my way of thinking.

Ali:
I appreciate the correction because you're right, I um I ought to say the French State the British State

Rania:
Yes

Ali:
but also if you are French or British or Israeli listening to this, I hope you hold your governors accountable um, you live in so-called democracies. You're meant to actually be able to influence the systems and um these systems are dominated again and again and again by tyrants, some of them you know quite proper looking, but all of them propping up awful systems that perpetuate suffering. So if you are French, you are British, yeah it's not personal, but you have a choice that is not available in all countries. If it's truly a democracy, I hope you'll exercise your right. And if it's not, I hope you'll challenge the system. In any case, challenge the system.

Em yes, I think Rania that it is so important in um even debating our opposing part, in um challenging the other, we can't forget that uh they're either a good intentioned human who sees things through the spectrum of their people's suffering, their personal fear, or an ill-intentioned human who wasn't designed to be this way. There is humanity in each of us and um yeah -

Rania:
yeah I mean.. sorry keep going -

Ali:
I would hope for myself. I, you know, I don't do it much anymore, respond to or debate um these inflammatory uh people who drop in on my posts um, but they shut up, they quiet down when I say I'm gonna pray for you. And oh I'd love to share this. Oh I would love to share this. I'll need just a moment to -

Rania:
yes sure sure -

Ali:
to look it up but it speaks exactly of this. It's a prayer I came across recently and uh so so beautiful if only I can I can find it -

Rania:
you'll find it, you'll find it. Yeah it's, meeting people or working on meeting people with the light inside us instead of with the darkness inside us. That's how I am approaching it
-

Ali:
all right -

Rania:
and there is light, there's light inside everybody, even if it's a tiny little, tiny little flashlight or a huge, huge one, but there's some light in everybody. You found it?

Ali:
I did. I want to credit this beautiful human being and I'll do that after. I'll read the whole thing. Okay.

"Visualize a Palestine that is free, free of bombs, free of oppression and terrorism in any form, where there is peace, equality, and safety, where the women sing under olive trees, where children have dreams and can grow up to live them. Visualize a Palestine that is free. Visualize an Israel that is free, free of indoctrination, free of supremacy, free of the colonial paradigm, free of the normalization of its governments' violence and cruelty. Visualize a people that understand the historical crimes committed and negotiate for a peaceful and just solution. Visualize an Israel that recognizes Palestinian freedom and Jewish safety are not mutually exclusive but codependent, where there is peace, equality, and safety for all beings. Visualize an Israel that is free."

This was, uh, not it but um, ah this bit.

"Travel to the aggressors and their enablers, hold a mirror to them that they may remember their humanity. Envision a world where Palestinian and Israeli people live in peace in freedom in dignity equally. Hold the mirror to them that they may remember their humanity."

It says it all that -

Rania:
yeah -

Ali:
doesn't it? It's acknowledging the darkness but it's also recognizing that there is something behind that and -

Rania:
that's beautiful. That's the perfect way to end this episode. So you said you were going to acknowledge the person? -

Ali:
ah yes thank you. Ebyan Zanini.

Rania:
That's beautiful. Thank you so much for this amazing uh episode. I can't wait to uh to actually have it launched very soon. And um yeah, thank you for your time. And it was/ this is exactly what I wanted: meaningful conversations for a happier world. And that's exactly what we had. Thanks a lot -

Ali:
the appreciation is mutual. I'm/ I think I needed to have this conversation too. And thank you for all the wonderful reminders, and um for what you're doing.

Rania:
Thanks, thanks a lot Ali. And guys listening in, I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, please share it. I think uh we've shared some really important points here and I think they're definitely worth spreading. So uh thanks for tuning in and thank you Ali for for being with me today.

Ali:
My pleasure, have a beautiful grounded day.

Rania:
Thanks.

[Music] Thank you for tuning in to today's episode. Join me every other Thursday for a new one. Happiness for Humanity is available on YouTube and your favorite podcast platforms. If you found this episode valuable, please share it. Let's come together for a happier world. [Music]